You're a treasure Noah, I hope the best for you. Although for someone with Seasonal Depression, it's going to be hard to find a new narrative each year to follow...
I'm prone to a problem that may not fit your description of depression. I get into a vicious circle of depressing thoughts, and cannot stop thinking them over and over. It's happened a few times and lasts days.
What I found usually helps me is simply to list them on paper, to see that they are finite in number and put them behind me. I wonder if that might help in some cases of depression.
Thank you for this. My son is growing up and I'm seeing some tendencies toward depression, and your articulation of how depression feels and what can be done to support people who are depressed gave me some new perspective and ways to think about how we might support him.
Also, I've really liked following your other work on here lately! I think you often have a perspective that's just beyond what I'd understood to be the parameters of the discussion before and learning about these other factors is illuminating.
Thank you Noah! So much of this rings true for me. Behavioral activation is crucial for me, kind of like daily — even moment by moment — training to form and reinforce my different narrative and thus crush my thought distortions. Having Bun, the rabbit, helps immensely 🐇❤️
Yeah I personally never improved anxiety and depression until addiction forced me into AA where the low pressure human contact finally got me to a place where I could engage with CBT with professionals and informally through the program. I haven't drank in 9 years but I still describe my beginning of relapses as that onset of depression you describe I slip into when I slip from the permanent lifestyle changes you talk about
Dabrowski's positive disintegration can be a very helpful framework in which to view depression and neurosis and anxiety, and to see the disintegration and reintegration processes as necessary to personal growth.
Very insightful post Noah and very brave to openly discuss the trauma. Especially the part about needing human company, the part about and Crappy counselors. Look up the book “Perfectly Hidden Depression” and I bet you will see yourself.
After my father committed suicide in 2001 I became crippled emotionally and eventually hospitalized voluntarily. Group was not helpful for me. It was terrifying. Being normal and not talking about it helped me more than anything.
Relapse happened in 2014 when I was with a Wall St investment banking firm. I was caught by surprise and beat myself up for “falling again “. I felt even worse because what does a white investment banker have to be sad about?
CBT is great. I use an app called Woebot that is surprisingly good, assuming it’s not saving my data for later blackmail.
I wish you well and thanks for posting about this. It’s group therapy without the terror.
if you can't get a therapist or don't want to, the book "Feeling Good" explains how to do CBT yourself (written by one of the originators of the technique). It is cheap, available at most bookstores, and has seriously helped a lot of people. You have to get over the fact that it's an extremely corny self-help book, but the techniques in there are well-validated clinically. It didn't really cure depression for me but it helped a huge amount.
You're a treasure Noah, I hope the best for you. Although for someone with Seasonal Depression, it's going to be hard to find a new narrative each year to follow...
Thank you, Noah....I can't tell you how timely this is for me. I'm sorry you've suffered like this. Nobody ever should.
This is a very moving and thoughtful post, thanks. People nerdy enough to subscribe to this substack may also be interested in Scott Alexander's recent post on depression: https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/peer-review-request-depression/
I'm prone to a problem that may not fit your description of depression. I get into a vicious circle of depressing thoughts, and cannot stop thinking them over and over. It's happened a few times and lasts days.
What I found usually helps me is simply to list them on paper, to see that they are finite in number and put them behind me. I wonder if that might help in some cases of depression.
Your #6... OMG. I'm trying hard to change my negative narrative. Thank you.
Thank you. Mirrors my experience especially your description of what it is like
Thank you for this. My son is growing up and I'm seeing some tendencies toward depression, and your articulation of how depression feels and what can be done to support people who are depressed gave me some new perspective and ways to think about how we might support him.
Also, I've really liked following your other work on here lately! I think you often have a perspective that's just beyond what I'd understood to be the parameters of the discussion before and learning about these other factors is illuminating.
Thank you Noah! So much of this rings true for me. Behavioral activation is crucial for me, kind of like daily — even moment by moment — training to form and reinforce my different narrative and thus crush my thought distortions. Having Bun, the rabbit, helps immensely 🐇❤️
Recently purchased, but haven't read yet "a cure for Darkness: the story of depression"
Brilliant piece, shared the original many times.
Yeah I personally never improved anxiety and depression until addiction forced me into AA where the low pressure human contact finally got me to a place where I could engage with CBT with professionals and informally through the program. I haven't drank in 9 years but I still describe my beginning of relapses as that onset of depression you describe I slip into when I slip from the permanent lifestyle changes you talk about
Going through this rn, hard :(
Dabrowski's positive disintegration can be a very helpful framework in which to view depression and neurosis and anxiety, and to see the disintegration and reintegration processes as necessary to personal growth.
Very insightful post Noah and very brave to openly discuss the trauma. Especially the part about needing human company, the part about and Crappy counselors. Look up the book “Perfectly Hidden Depression” and I bet you will see yourself.
After my father committed suicide in 2001 I became crippled emotionally and eventually hospitalized voluntarily. Group was not helpful for me. It was terrifying. Being normal and not talking about it helped me more than anything.
Relapse happened in 2014 when I was with a Wall St investment banking firm. I was caught by surprise and beat myself up for “falling again “. I felt even worse because what does a white investment banker have to be sad about?
CBT is great. I use an app called Woebot that is surprisingly good, assuming it’s not saving my data for later blackmail.
I wish you well and thanks for posting about this. It’s group therapy without the terror.
I've rarely read something that resonates so much with me. Thank you.
if you can't get a therapist or don't want to, the book "Feeling Good" explains how to do CBT yourself (written by one of the originators of the technique). It is cheap, available at most bookstores, and has seriously helped a lot of people. You have to get over the fact that it's an extremely corny self-help book, but the techniques in there are well-validated clinically. It didn't really cure depression for me but it helped a huge amount.